Open Thread: Would You Go Back?
Although we write for all types of web workers, we know that a lot of our readers have migrated to web work from a more traditional corporate environment. Corporations know it too, and the drain of knowledge workers to freer pastures is starting to get noticed. This is one of the reasons why we see things like the fabled benefits at Google, cubicles redesigned to help “recruit and retain top talent,” and the emergence of employee retention consulting as a specialized field.
The question is, does any of this matter? Once you’ve tasted the digital bedouin lifestyle, or gotten used to telecommuting, are you really enticed by chef-prepared pasta and prettier cubicles? If the rock-bottom requirement was that you had to show up physically in the office every day, what would a company have to do to hire you?
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I’m not interested in more than a five minute walk to work. If Google or Facebook or the next big thing are willing to pay me enough to live near them I would give it a try.
I recently took on a six-month full-time assignment (in a horrendously boring location) that requires me to get up at 6am everyday for the first time since high school. The position includes significant amounts of responsibility and lots (and lots) of diverse projects, which keeps my attention span. Admittedly, I am mostly here because the owner has been a mentor of mine for some time and I wanted to return some of his many favors. He wooed me with a new car, the promise of a 40-hour workweek (so I can continue pursuing my other projects), a generous salary, and flexible vacation time.
I’m only on month two and I’m ready to rip all of my hair out. Not worth it. Don’t do it — for any salary or any length of time exceeding a few weeks. The only way I’m going to make it out of this and retain my sanity/happiness is to think of how much better/faster I’ll be able to accomplish my own personal goals after this experience (or, more honestly, after these paychecks). I suppose if you need a reminder of why you quit working for “the man” in the first place, going back might make for a rude awakening.
No way, Jose. Nuh-uh. If Corporate America really wants to employ me and my ilk, Corporate America needs to revisit its dreadful office design (why no natural light? No windows that open? The locations far from public transit?), its miserly vacation and leave policies (ten paid days a year?!), and its steadfast assumption that butts-in-chairs==productive, “team player” employees.
Where do/did you guys work? I used to work in Portland, I had to get up at the crack of 9am to hop on a bus to go into work where my desk sat next to a window. That I could open. It was a government job, so the vacation and holidays were pretty plentiful as well.
I’ve worked from home most of the last decade, and 100% for the last year.
I absolutely love it. I am far more productive, better rested, and ready to go at the beginning of each day.
I can’t imagine losing those advantages. Whatever the future may hold, I’ll find a way to tackle it from here.
For me to go back? They’d have to let me work my own hours, let me have my children underfoot (particularly my 11 month old nursling) and pay me a boatload of cash in addition to it otherwise being my dream job. Honestly, even after the kids are older and in school, I can’t really see myself working for someone else. I love what I do. I love getting to work with my husband and my virtual officemates (fellow webworkers). And I particulalry love that I don’t have to choose between having my career and being a good parent.
I’m just getting set to make the jump now, so in case anyone needs his or her memory refreshed…
- meetings where only two people out of seven are paying attention
- busy work
- writing documents obviously destined for a drawer
- waking up early so you can get to work early so you can get back home early
- having to request time off
- summertime commutes on public transportation
- summertime office air conditioning
- dealing with HR departments
- corporate retreats with PowerPoint presentations about “strategy”
Had enough?
Wow. I like being around exciting, creative, funny people. I did the whole work from home thing but needed, craved, the crucible of creativity that is being around people from admin assistants to account managers to creative directors. For me it’s people that make life fun, not the size of your cubicle.
I don’t think it would happen unless it was for a lot of money. After all, my hourly rate went up substantially for the same type of work! Plus I can work in pyjamas if I want, plus fireup the laptop at night and do work, or take a day off whenever I want, or just coast for a couple days without doing billable work.
If I were to go back to the corporate life it’d need to be awfully flexible, and pay better than my last job.
I’m about 3 weeks out of the corporate grind. I’m at that point where I can’t tell why I didn’t do this years earlier.
I had asked myself this question in my second week, because I’m treating my departure from the corporate world as a trial separation. I’m not sure it’s something I’m going to be into — I’m already lonely for co-workers. Being the dad, and my wife a stay-at-home mom, I was also sure that we would get sick of each other more often (we do), and that I’d simply become a 3/4 time babysitter while still trying to put in billable hours.
So far, all of my fears have come true, but I’m working through them. The upside is that productive time is really productive time, so I don’t generally need 8 hours a day to get everything done that needs doing. A lot of the advantages mentioned above have been realized too — I love taking the kids to a doctor’s appointment, having to wait 2 hours, but not feeling guilty about missing work (okay, I don’t love the waiting 2 hours part… but you understand).
Telecommuting. ;-)
Very interesting – I like the office atmosphere MOST of the time. The big problem is a small minority of small minded people who are rude, aggressive and are political bullsh*tters. They drive me cRaZY!
In my mind, I must work with authentic people, who are honest, open and creative + want to work in a fun and exciting environment. I need to work with like-minded people and at the moment 99% of them don’t know what RSS is :-( Depressing.
I can’t imagine going back to traditional employment. I love controlling my own schedule, taking time off when I want, and deciding what my projects and priorities are.
Stewart says “I like being around exciting, creative, funny people.” I totally agree with that sentiment — and I find so many exciting, creative, funny people to work with online.
That said, I could imagine that it’d be nice to work in an office with other people on a regular basis. I might look into a coworking setup at some point.
I’ve been reflecting a bit more on my earlier commment about missing the companionship of the office environment. Unfortunately, because I’m in a small town, coworking isn’t really an option (betcha I’d be hard pressed to find one other web worker in this town).
What do any/all of you think about a virtual co-working setup? Something like getting a Campfire plan, splitting the cost among all members, and then you’ve got your virtual water cooler right there?
I’m not officially a web worker yet, but that’s one part of what I do at MPOW, which is a public library. Before that I was in cubicle world as a software engineer. I read Dilbert as a documentary. What would it take to get me to go back there? Mmm. A private office with a window looking out onto a beautiful nature scene? …. Nah. Even that wouldn’t do it. The physical environment is a big part of the problem with working at today’s corporations, but it’s not the only aspect.
I’d have to lose all my clients with no hope of quickly picking up more to give up on being self-employed. The ability to just close up shop for a few hours and take my kids to the park, or knock out some mid-day shopping, or knock out work in the evenings (or in the park, since we have citywide wifi) is just too glorious to give up. I’ve been in too many office situations where everything started out great with great bosses, co-workers, etc, and it all went to hell after two years. I typically am very project-oriented, so the daily grind of just “maintaining” kills me.
I look at it from the exact opposite perspective as Ted.
I’ll give first priority to anyone who pays well, but:
1. Give me the privilege of doing the job right.
2. Give me the responsibility of ensuring that it’s done right.
3. Accept that my eggs will always be not only in your basket, but a few others as well.
4. Don’t put me in a situation where the amount of time I spend on the commute is any more than ten percent of the time I spend on your projects.
Anyone who can’t deal with these stipulations, well, Tough Shit. Bizdev is far from being my favorite activity, but it still beats being treated like a mere tool.
@TED –I thought I was the only basket case out there that got fed up of the corporate politics in two years time. The first half year is fresh and exciting, the second one is when you really get into the zone of things. Then the third half year kicks in and you know what is actually going on , grumbling aside, when finally the fourth half year you end up sick of it all, the dirty politics, the run and maintain.
Lucky enough I found an employer that contracts me through a third party which actually promotes homework/webwork. I got all my tools, they don’t care where I am as long as I get my job done. so it is not full webworker, but more like webworker 1.5. Not self-employed but self-managed.
I do know that I will never return to the 8 hour/5 day a week in the office just because it is “standard”. I am more productive, more proactive, more professional these days. And I love it.
The drain of knowledge workers starting to get noticed eh? Two words:
bew hew
The VP of “I’m smarter than you because my car chirps” should have thought of that before reprioritizing his/her strategic paradigm initiatives and firing everyone. Looking around and can’t find anyone that knows how to do anything?
QQ
Want some of us back? Here’s the short list, Captain Powerpoint. Pay attention this time, kay?
1. Zero-tolerance for office politics. This is not negotiable. At all.
2. Guaranteed contracts. Full benefits.
3. Everyone gets an office. Cubicles are gone. Forevah.
4. The person who calls a meeting pays for it out of their own paycheck.
5. Everyone gets to telecommute. All the time.
6. The HR department gets replaced with a bowling alley.
7. Part-time and flexible scheduling.
8. Unless the company is in Chapter 7, no layoffs. Period.
But the corporate types are too weaksauce to understand how real human beings work. None of this will ever happen. So here is my advice to the corporate types who are losing too many knowledge workers:
Cry more.
It’s possible to have the best of both worlds. Smart companies are letting their people work from home exactly as much as they want to, with the option to come in to the office when they need to. Sun Microsystems is one good example.
I work for a company that allows me to work remotely from time to time (which I do almost every Friday [I'm still new]), but sometimes, I actually find being in the office more motivating when I’ve got a tight deadline. Plus, I’m still a newer developer so it’s nice to talk face-to-face with people in my department on how to aproach a new project or just get some advice. Though, to my company’s credit, I get to wear mostly whatever I want (just no shorts or horribly offensive things), we don’t have many meetings at all, and I can stream whatever music I damn well please (^_-). Oh yeah, free pop is nice too.
Would I go back? I just want to get OUT! I have taken some of your advise from previous postings on working from home….checked some of the job posting sites, sent resumes to companies on my own, etc. I am still stuck in my large front office, facing a “old dog” type office manager all day, missing my daughter while she is at summer day care, worried that I only have 3 days of paid vacation time left, trying to look busy, even when I’m not so I don’t get that look. If any of you have some new ideas on where a person can get a real job working from home….I am listening! HELP!
The biggest departure for me was to see the impact of my work almost immediately. I used to work for Procter & Gamble, at a diaper manufacturing facility. I learned a ton in terms of management, but compare that to what you can accomplish (in terms of product management and product development) online and it’s like day and night.
A good example of this is what we’ve been able to accomplish at TuDiabetes.com, a Social Network for Diabetics that I founded recently. Thanks to the sheer power of other sites linking to it, membership has skyrocketed over the weekend. Try to do that in the physical world… You can’t reproduce it.
Working at home means worrying about whether they’ll be any work tomorrow (or next week), keeping many more tax records (and paying through the NOSE at tax time), spending huge swaths of time on your own, having to manage your own time and police it against all would-be intruders.
I wouldn’t ever want to romanticize it :) — and if the right 9-5 came along, I’d still take it. BUT now that I’ve tasted a decent hourly wage, setting my own hours, and getting AWAY from all the really terrible things that attended my last job working in a large bureacracy…. well, it’s pretty great, I have to admit. But I do fantasize, still, about something that would combine the best of both worlds…
I would be very, very slow to ever return to the 9-5 corporate grind. A great salary would only be part of the necessary program to get me back to corporate life. Flexible scheduling, better office conditions, accessibility without driving, etc, etc. I don’t see myself going back though. Sorry corporate America. Wake up and outsource to all of us freelancing web workers!
I’ve been able to work at home occasionally at various jobs, but would love to return to that permanently. I’m at a cube job right now and luckily they are flexible about hours, but I’d say that my ideal come-into-the-office situation would be one where I could come in much later. I’m in Chicago and one of the train lines is undergoing a major overhaul, so it’s affecting commute times for everyone. My single biggest peeve is how much of my personal time is wasted during my commute to and from work.
We employ some of the best knowledge workers in the world. I have staff that works all around the world. If I have to tell you what to do, we are both in the wrong job. Work where you will, do what needs to get done.
What’s wrong with that?
@Stewart: Yeah, that’s what I meant by my working at Facebook comment. But let’s face it, most companies aren’t like that.
I work in an office right now. I absolutely hate it. I have a web project I’m working on at home that I hope will allow me to be self employed. I love working on that site from home. I hate commuting to an office and dealing with the office life. End of story. If I can help it, im never coming back to corporate America.
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