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	<title>Comments on: Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We&#039;ll Use More Energy Not Less</title>
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		<title>By: Joel Greenberg</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/cleantech/metcalfe-on-smart-grid-if-it-works-well-use-more-energy-not-less/#comment-25874</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Joel Greenberg]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Apr 2010 15:22:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://earth2tech.com/?p=39130#comment-25874</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;p&gt;Metcalfe mentions this in all his talks, so I asked him to clarify what he meant by it &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.tech2energy.com/2010/04/08/bob-metcalfe-investing-in-energy-with-lessons-learned-from-networking/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;when I recently interviewed him&lt;/a&gt; for my Tech2Energy podcast.  &quot;If the Internet is any guide, when we are done solving energy,&quot; said Metcalfe, &quot;...which I don&#039;t think will happen for decades...but when we&#039;re done solving energy, we will not being use less energy than we  use now. We&#039;ll be using more.  A lot more.  That is, if we make energy cheap and clean...and by the way, it can&#039;t just be cheap and it can&#039;t just be clean, it has to be both, cheap and clean...when we succeed at that...the amount of energy available to us and the amount of energy we consume will be a lot more. I don&#039;t mean 50% more; I&#039;m talking ten times more, a hundred times more than we use now because it will be squanderably abundant the way bandwidth is now.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;This is Metcalfe&#039;s long-term prediction.  Maybe within our lifetime.  To act like his prediction has come true today, or in the near future, is an incorrect extrapolation of his idea.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I agree with you, I think efficiency is more appropriate right now while we as a culture work a number of tracks in parallel, the &quot;Enernet&quot; being one of those parallel tracks.  I believe &quot;efficiency&quot; is a more useful concept than &quot;conservation.&quot;  &quot;Conservation&quot; has a shade of meaning that implies doing without, whereas &quot;efficiency&quot; means doing more with less.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;But to put timelines in perspective, if you take a look at the payback for commercial and/or residential solar power, or commercial and/or residential energy retrofits for buildings and houses, the pay back is generally in the 10-15 year time frame.  When Metcalfe talks &quot;decades&quot;, he&#039;s talking at least 20 years, if not  30, 40 or longer.  So efficiency has a shorter payback of at least 1/2 to 1/4 of the time Metcalfe is talking about.  And, it&#039;s much easier to implement.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;We can add solar and do energy efficiency retrofits today.  Right now.  With existing technology, infrastructure, and companies.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;As a futurist&#039;s goal setting statement, I think Metcalfe&#039;s idea is useful in that we create the future we envision.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Joel Greenberg
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.tech2energy.com&gt;Tech2energy.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Metcalfe mentions this in all his talks, so I asked him to clarify what he meant by it <a href="http://www.tech2energy.com/2010/04/08/bob-metcalfe-investing-in-energy-with-lessons-learned-from-networking/" rel="nofollow">when I recently interviewed him</a> for my Tech2Energy podcast.  &#8220;If the Internet is any guide, when we are done solving energy,&#8221; said Metcalfe, &#8220;&#8230;which I don&#8217;t think will happen for decades&#8230;but when we&#8217;re done solving energy, we will not being use less energy than we  use now. We&#8217;ll be using more.  A lot more.  That is, if we make energy cheap and clean&#8230;and by the way, it can&#8217;t just be cheap and it can&#8217;t just be clean, it has to be both, cheap and clean&#8230;when we succeed at that&#8230;the amount of energy available to us and the amount of energy we consume will be a lot more. I don&#8217;t mean 50% more; I&#8217;m talking ten times more, a hundred times more than we use now because it will be squanderably abundant the way bandwidth is now.&#8221;</p>
<p>This is Metcalfe&#8217;s long-term prediction.  Maybe within our lifetime.  To act like his prediction has come true today, or in the near future, is an incorrect extrapolation of his idea.</p>
<p>I agree with you, I think efficiency is more appropriate right now while we as a culture work a number of tracks in parallel, the &#8220;Enernet&#8221; being one of those parallel tracks.  I believe &#8220;efficiency&#8221; is a more useful concept than &#8220;conservation.&#8221;  &#8220;Conservation&#8221; has a shade of meaning that implies doing without, whereas &#8220;efficiency&#8221; means doing more with less.</p>
<p>But to put timelines in perspective, if you take a look at the payback for commercial and/or residential solar power, or commercial and/or residential energy retrofits for buildings and houses, the pay back is generally in the 10-15 year time frame.  When Metcalfe talks &#8220;decades&#8221;, he&#8217;s talking at least 20 years, if not  30, 40 or longer.  So efficiency has a shorter payback of at least 1/2 to 1/4 of the time Metcalfe is talking about.  And, it&#8217;s much easier to implement.</p>
<p>We can add solar and do energy efficiency retrofits today.  Right now.  With existing technology, infrastructure, and companies.</p>
<p>As a futurist&#8217;s goal setting statement, I think Metcalfe&#8217;s idea is useful in that we create the future we envision.</p>
<p>Joel Greenberg<br />
&lt;a href=&#8221;http://www.tech2energy.com&gt;Tech2energy.com</p>
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		<title>By: Smart Grid Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We’ll Use More Energy Not Less</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/cleantech/metcalfe-on-smart-grid-if-it-works-well-use-more-energy-not-less/#comment-25873</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Smart Grid Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We’ll Use More Energy Not Less]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Aug 2009 21:56:26 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[&lt;p&gt;[...] via Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We’ll Use More Energy Not Less. [...]&lt;/p&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] via Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We’ll Use More Energy Not Less. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We’ll Use More Energy Not Less &#171; SmartGrid Current</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/cleantech/metcalfe-on-smart-grid-if-it-works-well-use-more-energy-not-less/#comment-25872</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We’ll Use More Energy Not Less &#171; SmartGrid Current]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Aug 2009 14:07:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://earth2tech.com/?p=39130#comment-25872</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;p&gt;[...] Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We’ll Use More Energy Not&#160;Less    Posted August 15, 2009 Filed under: Uncategorized &#124;   http://earth2tech.com/2009/08/14/metcalfe-on-smart-grid-if-it-works-well-use-more-energy-not-less/ [...]&lt;/p&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Metcalfe on Smart Grid: If It Works, We’ll Use More Energy Not&nbsp;Less    Posted August 15, 2009 Filed under: Uncategorized |   <a href="http://earth2tech.com/2009/08/14/metcalfe-on-smart-grid-if-it-works-well-use-more-energy-not-less/" rel="nofollow">http://earth2tech.com/2009/08/14/metcalfe-on-smart-grid-if-it-works-well-use-more-energy-not-less/</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: dirky</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/cleantech/metcalfe-on-smart-grid-if-it-works-well-use-more-energy-not-less/#comment-25871</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dirky]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Aug 2009 16:42:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://earth2tech.com/?p=39130#comment-25871</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;p&gt;Ban Fire.  It&#039;s the only way that energy will ever be completely clean.  No burning coal, no burning gas, no campfires.  Well...  Oh, too, btw.  Fire was created by the devil, and until we learn that, we will continue to suffer him, and suffer each other.&lt;/p&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ban Fire.  It&#8217;s the only way that energy will ever be completely clean.  No burning coal, no burning gas, no campfires.  Well&#8230;  Oh, too, btw.  Fire was created by the devil, and until we learn that, we will continue to suffer him, and suffer each other.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/cleantech/metcalfe-on-smart-grid-if-it-works-well-use-more-energy-not-less/#comment-25870</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mike]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Aug 2009 12:58:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://earth2tech.com/?p=39130#comment-25870</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;p&gt;I would agree that eventually use will go up but not because it&#039;s all clean and people feel good about using it. I think it will go up because there will be more value in using it. If it truly becomes a &quot;smart grid&quot;, we will all want to use it more. Compare it to telecom networks. As the intelligence grew, so did usage. Cable TV networks and the internet are other examples. The &quot;smart grid&quot; will drive more applications and more usage.&lt;/p&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would agree that eventually use will go up but not because it&#8217;s all clean and people feel good about using it. I think it will go up because there will be more value in using it. If it truly becomes a &#8220;smart grid&#8221;, we will all want to use it more. Compare it to telecom networks. As the intelligence grew, so did usage. Cable TV networks and the internet are other examples. The &#8220;smart grid&#8221; will drive more applications and more usage.</p>
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