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	<title>Comments on: Third-party iTunes Syncing: It&#8217;s Not Just About Palm</title>
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		<title>By: Stacy Haven</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349044</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stacy Haven]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jan 2010 16:40:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349044</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If you &#039;agree&#039; with this article then you don&#039;t completely understand the problem or shall I say problems. There are two problems at play here. 
1. What is iTunes if not a stand alone app?
2. Why is Apple trying to play both sides of the fence with iTunes?

Question 1 is plainly obvious. Can you use iTunes without an iPod? The answer is clearly and cleanly YES. Does it offer benefits and uses as a stand  alone application? Again clearly yes. I don&#039;t think anyone is denying that Apple has created a fantastic application with iTunes. Nor is anyone trying to diminish the quality or compatibility of it. But lets be honest if iTunes was meant to only work with iPod&#039;s or any other apple hardware, why doesn&#039;t ship with the iPod? I mean do you need an internet connection to sync? NO!!! You need an internet connection to BUY. The whole premise of what iTunes is, is a market place for buying music, video and what ever type of media that Apple decides to throw your way. Do they charge to download iTunes if you don&#039;t have one of their iPod&#039;s? Of course not. They still want your money for music purchases even if you don&#039;t have one of their audio devices. 

Now onto question 2. Come on Apple is it hardware or software you are peddling. Apple doesn&#039;t give iTunes away with iPod&#039;s nor is there a barrier to entry for getting iTunes. They are not going to stop someone for buying music on iTunes if they don&#039;t have an iPod. Heck anyone can download iTunes with an internet connection. They aren&#039;t even worried about it being a marketing tool. You don&#039;t even have to register to download it. When I say play both sides of the fence I mean if iTunes can and is used as a stand alone application why are they insisting that it is only meant for use with Apple approved devices? Their devices are great and all, but there is a reason that other devices exist on the market. I have a 6 year old that can barely keep track of her shoes. Why on earth would I go and give her an almost $100 item to lose or better yet put through the wash? I have already taken the time and effort to put all of my music in iTunes. Dare I say hours making sure all of the albums have graphics and all of my cd&#039;s are ripped and nicely organized into folders. Purchased music for my kids to listen to on the computer before they were old enough to be trusted with an iPod.

The idea of allowing other devices to work with iTunes is not one of compatibility it is market power. They are trying to keep iPod&#039;s on top. iTunes is responsible for 69% of digital music sales. So by forcing consumers to only use iPod&#039;s with iTunes they are locking the average consumer into their hardware, but it in a fairly deceptive way. 

It isn&#039;t that I think Apple is wrong for wanting to keep their hardware on top, but they got into the software market of pushing digital music long before they got into issues of who can work with iTunes. I realize Palm Pre is the first one to push it to extreme, but they won&#039;t be the last. 

Stac...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you &#8216;agree&#8217; with this article then you don&#8217;t completely understand the problem or shall I say problems. There are two problems at play here.<br />
1. What is iTunes if not a stand alone app?<br />
2. Why is Apple trying to play both sides of the fence with iTunes?</p>
<p>Question 1 is plainly obvious. Can you use iTunes without an iPod? The answer is clearly and cleanly YES. Does it offer benefits and uses as a stand  alone application? Again clearly yes. I don&#8217;t think anyone is denying that Apple has created a fantastic application with iTunes. Nor is anyone trying to diminish the quality or compatibility of it. But lets be honest if iTunes was meant to only work with iPod&#8217;s or any other apple hardware, why doesn&#8217;t ship with the iPod? I mean do you need an internet connection to sync? NO!!! You need an internet connection to BUY. The whole premise of what iTunes is, is a market place for buying music, video and what ever type of media that Apple decides to throw your way. Do they charge to download iTunes if you don&#8217;t have one of their iPod&#8217;s? Of course not. They still want your money for music purchases even if you don&#8217;t have one of their audio devices. </p>
<p>Now onto question 2. Come on Apple is it hardware or software you are peddling. Apple doesn&#8217;t give iTunes away with iPod&#8217;s nor is there a barrier to entry for getting iTunes. They are not going to stop someone for buying music on iTunes if they don&#8217;t have an iPod. Heck anyone can download iTunes with an internet connection. They aren&#8217;t even worried about it being a marketing tool. You don&#8217;t even have to register to download it. When I say play both sides of the fence I mean if iTunes can and is used as a stand alone application why are they insisting that it is only meant for use with Apple approved devices? Their devices are great and all, but there is a reason that other devices exist on the market. I have a 6 year old that can barely keep track of her shoes. Why on earth would I go and give her an almost $100 item to lose or better yet put through the wash? I have already taken the time and effort to put all of my music in iTunes. Dare I say hours making sure all of the albums have graphics and all of my cd&#8217;s are ripped and nicely organized into folders. Purchased music for my kids to listen to on the computer before they were old enough to be trusted with an iPod.</p>
<p>The idea of allowing other devices to work with iTunes is not one of compatibility it is market power. They are trying to keep iPod&#8217;s on top. iTunes is responsible for 69% of digital music sales. So by forcing consumers to only use iPod&#8217;s with iTunes they are locking the average consumer into their hardware, but it in a fairly deceptive way. </p>
<p>It isn&#8217;t that I think Apple is wrong for wanting to keep their hardware on top, but they got into the software market of pushing digital music long before they got into issues of who can work with iTunes. I realize Palm Pre is the first one to push it to extreme, but they won&#8217;t be the last. </p>
<p>Stac&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: iTunes 8.2.1 Released, Rains On Palm Pre’s Parade</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349043</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[iTunes 8.2.1 Released, Rains On Palm Pre’s Parade]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:58:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349043</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] already downloaded and installed the update, it ends the iTunes playlist syncing party, too. It was inevitable, since Apple clearly regards iTunes syncing as the exclusive, sacred territory of their own [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] already downloaded and installed the update, it ends the iTunes playlist syncing party, too. It was inevitable, since Apple clearly regards iTunes syncing as the exclusive, sacred territory of their own [...]</p>
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		<title>By: iTunes 8.2.1 Released, Rains On Palm Pre&#8217;s Parade</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349042</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[iTunes 8.2.1 Released, Rains On Palm Pre&#8217;s Parade]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:14:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349042</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] already downloaded and installed the update, it ends the iTunes playlist syncing party, too. It was inevitable, since Apple clearly regards iTunes syncing as the exclusive, sacred territory of their own [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] already downloaded and installed the update, it ends the iTunes playlist syncing party, too. It was inevitable, since Apple clearly regards iTunes syncing as the exclusive, sacred territory of their own [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: SamH</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349041</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SamH]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Jun 2009 07:00:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349041</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As have been touched on in the discussion so far, I think the two points below are the most relevant in terms of what can result between Apple and its customers linked to the Pre:

1. There are 100,000+ plus Pre users which have chosen a smartphone that is not the iPhone (for many reasons that include carrier, customer needs etc, as with any product choice) – nothing can change this. So Apple is left with either the option of either making revenue from this customer base buying non-DRM content on the iTunes Store, or not. If they shut out this customer base, they will increase sales to their competitor Amazon – so considering this, is it logical for Apple to take measures to forego this revenue in exchange for none?

2. Third party solutions that sync devices with iTunes are commonplace (such as Blackberry&#039;s) whereby people can get their content managed on iTunes onto their device – so in a way, does it really matter whether a device like the Pre syncs within iTunes vs a device like the Storm which syncs with a minor third party element? No fuss was created when RIM introduced its third-party iTunes sync (and rightly so as an independent piece of software) but at the end of the day, the Pre (and RIM devices and others) are and will continue to access iTunes. If Apple block the Pre, they can release a RIM-style third party solution and Pres will STILL sync with iTunes. Locking the Pre out of iTunes wont change that.... so ultimately would that measure achieve anything? Ultimately, companies will seek ways to connect iTunes&#039; content management to their devices anyway.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As have been touched on in the discussion so far, I think the two points below are the most relevant in terms of what can result between Apple and its customers linked to the Pre:</p>
<p>1. There are 100,000+ plus Pre users which have chosen a smartphone that is not the iPhone (for many reasons that include carrier, customer needs etc, as with any product choice) – nothing can change this. So Apple is left with either the option of either making revenue from this customer base buying non-DRM content on the iTunes Store, or not. If they shut out this customer base, they will increase sales to their competitor Amazon – so considering this, is it logical for Apple to take measures to forego this revenue in exchange for none?</p>
<p>2. Third party solutions that sync devices with iTunes are commonplace (such as Blackberry&#8217;s) whereby people can get their content managed on iTunes onto their device – so in a way, does it really matter whether a device like the Pre syncs within iTunes vs a device like the Storm which syncs with a minor third party element? No fuss was created when RIM introduced its third-party iTunes sync (and rightly so as an independent piece of software) but at the end of the day, the Pre (and RIM devices and others) are and will continue to access iTunes. If Apple block the Pre, they can release a RIM-style third party solution and Pres will STILL sync with iTunes. Locking the Pre out of iTunes wont change that&#8230;. so ultimately would that measure achieve anything? Ultimately, companies will seek ways to connect iTunes&#8217; content management to their devices anyway.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dan Hallock</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349040</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Hallock]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 18:32:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349040</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[That just ain&#039;t so — most of the iTunes library is _duplicated_ to the iTunes Library XML file, and any vendor can _read_ this. But you can&#039;t write to the XML file and expect iTunes to pick up on it.

I&#039;m curious about third-party devices showing up in the sidebar and being writable — do you have any examples? I only know of things like the Slingbox and Simplify Media, which use DAAP to be playable through iTunes; they show up as shared libraries. But just like real shared libraries, you can&#039;t copy music into or out of them through iTunes.

However, it is possible to manipulate the iTunes library through the COM API on Windows and through AppleScript on the Mac, so it _is_ possible for a third party to write a complete iTunes syncing tool, which reads from the XML file and writes through COM/AppleScript.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That just ain&#8217;t so — most of the iTunes library is _duplicated_ to the iTunes Library XML file, and any vendor can _read_ this. But you can&#8217;t write to the XML file and expect iTunes to pick up on it.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m curious about third-party devices showing up in the sidebar and being writable — do you have any examples? I only know of things like the Slingbox and Simplify Media, which use DAAP to be playable through iTunes; they show up as shared libraries. But just like real shared libraries, you can&#8217;t copy music into or out of them through iTunes.</p>
<p>However, it is possible to manipulate the iTunes library through the COM API on Windows and through AppleScript on the Mac, so it _is_ possible for a third party to write a complete iTunes syncing tool, which reads from the XML file and writes through COM/AppleScript.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Tom Reestman</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349039</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Reestman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 17:31:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349039</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Daren,

iTunes is not the closed system people think. Many devices can plug in and show up in the sidebar for manual drag and drop of media. Also, the iTunes library is stored as a simple XML file, which any vendor can write against. 

As I&#039;ve said before, the issue is not with a third party device using iTunes (Apple has no issue with that), it&#039;s about using iTunes SYNC. Apple specifically limits this to iPods as a differentiating feature, and Palm has proven this since they had to hack the system to imitate an iPod in order to get it to work.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Daren,</p>
<p>iTunes is not the closed system people think. Many devices can plug in and show up in the sidebar for manual drag and drop of media. Also, the iTunes library is stored as a simple XML file, which any vendor can write against. </p>
<p>As I&#8217;ve said before, the issue is not with a third party device using iTunes (Apple has no issue with that), it&#8217;s about using iTunes SYNC. Apple specifically limits this to iPods as a differentiating feature, and Palm has proven this since they had to hack the system to imitate an iPod in order to get it to work.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Daren McDougal</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349038</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Daren McDougal]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 12:42:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349038</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tom Reetsman i have another question for you then, I am a blackberry storm user, because nothing as yet does email like blackberry. Is blackberry also hacking with there media sync i guess somehow they jack the playlist function in itunes. Something else i thought i would throw out there and get your thoughts]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom Reetsman i have another question for you then, I am a blackberry storm user, because nothing as yet does email like blackberry. Is blackberry also hacking with there media sync i guess somehow they jack the playlist function in itunes. Something else i thought i would throw out there and get your thoughts</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Gib Wallis</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349037</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gib Wallis]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 06:08:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349037</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Apple should publish APIs that enable other devices to work with iTunes.

Apple currently has only one main competitor for online digital music distribution: Amazon.

Consumers should be able to buy their music and copy their music and sync their music wherever they like.  Whether it&#039;s an iPhone or iPod or BlackBerry or Palm Pre.

Reverse engineering for compatibility isn&#039;t the same thing as stealing source code -- or former employees revealing trade secrets (as the author here impugns the integrity of former Apple employees at Palm in this article).

I&#039;m against vertical integration -- and if you buy something from iTunes and have to use it with Apple hardware, it starts sounding to me like vertical integration, which the monopoly laws were conceived of to protect consumers from.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apple should publish APIs that enable other devices to work with iTunes.</p>
<p>Apple currently has only one main competitor for online digital music distribution: Amazon.</p>
<p>Consumers should be able to buy their music and copy their music and sync their music wherever they like.  Whether it&#8217;s an iPhone or iPod or BlackBerry or Palm Pre.</p>
<p>Reverse engineering for compatibility isn&#8217;t the same thing as stealing source code &#8212; or former employees revealing trade secrets (as the author here impugns the integrity of former Apple employees at Palm in this article).</p>
<p>I&#8217;m against vertical integration &#8212; and if you buy something from iTunes and have to use it with Apple hardware, it starts sounding to me like vertical integration, which the monopoly laws were conceived of to protect consumers from.</p>
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		<title>By: Raphaël Jacquot</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349036</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Raphaël Jacquot]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 21:23:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349036</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@dan:
Well, it is somehow related, in a way. It&#039;s about helping with compatibility... 
In the palm-pre issue, it&#039;s attempting to make consumers happy with a great piece of software and somehow keeping the business alive
in my issue, it&#039;s keeping consumers happy that somehow don&#039;t have either large platforms.
When you say &quot;the Linux development community haven&#039;t caught up to the Touch/iPhone syncing yet&quot;, you are pointing the wrong problem. The real issue there is that the syncing protocol is not properly documented for a free software implementation to be designed, that would allow the devices to be properly supported, so the community has to resort to reverse engineering, and it takes time and resources to obtain something that could have been done almost instantaneously if the proper doc had been available.
You&#039;re raising a good point. I would have, in fact, bought a non apple device, if I hadn&#039;t been offered this one. I&#039;m not of the generation that sells the thing on ebay if it doesn&#039;t exactly fit my needs, I tend to attempt to adapt, seeing the proposition as a challenge ;)
So yes, I think Apple is actually doing something wrong by not documenting the syncing protocol fully and wasting our time that way]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@dan:<br />
Well, it is somehow related, in a way. It&#8217;s about helping with compatibility&#8230;<br />
In the palm-pre issue, it&#8217;s attempting to make consumers happy with a great piece of software and somehow keeping the business alive<br />
in my issue, it&#8217;s keeping consumers happy that somehow don&#8217;t have either large platforms.<br />
When you say &#8220;the Linux development community haven&#8217;t caught up to the Touch/iPhone syncing yet&#8221;, you are pointing the wrong problem. The real issue there is that the syncing protocol is not properly documented for a free software implementation to be designed, that would allow the devices to be properly supported, so the community has to resort to reverse engineering, and it takes time and resources to obtain something that could have been done almost instantaneously if the proper doc had been available.<br />
You&#8217;re raising a good point. I would have, in fact, bought a non apple device, if I hadn&#8217;t been offered this one. I&#8217;m not of the generation that sells the thing on ebay if it doesn&#8217;t exactly fit my needs, I tend to attempt to adapt, seeing the proposition as a challenge ;)<br />
So yes, I think Apple is actually doing something wrong by not documenting the syncing protocol fully and wasting our time that way</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Hallock</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/apple/third-party-itunes-syncing-its-not-just-about-palm/#comment-349035</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Hallock]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 20:32:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theappleblog.com/?p=26403#comment-349035</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I just don&#039;t go all the way to &#039;should.&#039; I think there is ambiguity; there are ups and downs to each of the three main approaches they could take: actively block it, ignore it, or embrace it and start licensing iTunes as a platform. It&#039;s Apple&#039;s call to make.

(I do see a business argument for ignoring/tolerating the hacky sync: it&#039;s a known quantity. If they block it, and this pushes Palm into developing a full-on iPod/iTunes ecosystem competitor, Palm will _probably_ fail to make inroads. But what if they actually managed to develop and deliver as well as they have with the Pre device itself? It might be a smaller gamble for Apple to just tolerate the piggybacking… and of course, that means they keep a small part of Palm&#039;s business under their thumb.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just don&#8217;t go all the way to &#8216;should.&#8217; I think there is ambiguity; there are ups and downs to each of the three main approaches they could take: actively block it, ignore it, or embrace it and start licensing iTunes as a platform. It&#8217;s Apple&#8217;s call to make.</p>
<p>(I do see a business argument for ignoring/tolerating the hacky sync: it&#8217;s a known quantity. If they block it, and this pushes Palm into developing a full-on iPod/iTunes ecosystem competitor, Palm will _probably_ fail to make inroads. But what if they actually managed to develop and deliver as well as they have with the Pre device itself? It might be a smaller gamble for Apple to just tolerate the piggybacking… and of course, that means they keep a small part of Palm&#8217;s business under their thumb.)</p>
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