Apple Extends MacBook Pro NVIDIA GeForce Service Policy to Three Years
Addressing what evidently is a common defect in the NVIDIA GeForce 8600GT graphics processor units used in the May 2007 and Early 2008 revisions of the original MacBook Pro (remediation of which involves replacing the entire logic board), Apple has announced that it will lengthen coverage of its extended service program for this defect for at least another year.
A revised announcement on the Apple Support web site reads:
In July 2008, NVIDIA publicly acknowledged a higher than normal failure rate for some of their graphics processors due to a packaging defect. At that same time, NVIDIA assured Apple that Mac computers with these graphics processors were not affected. However, after an Apple-led investigation, Apple has determined that some MacBook Pro computers with the NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics processor may be affected. If the NVIDIA graphics processor in your MacBook Pro has failed, or fails within three years of the original date of purchase, a repair will be done free of charge, even if your MacBook Pro is out of warranty.
Last January, I commended Apple and NVIDIA for stepping up and taking some responsibility for this defect, but contended that the two-year coverage in effect at the time almost certainly did not go far enough. It seemed likely that the problem would eventually afflict most examples of those MacBook Pro models if they were used long enough, and once repaired, owners could not be confident of the issue not repeating itself after the two-year extended service eligibility or even three years of maximum AppleCare extended warranty coverage.
Anyone buying a computer as expensive as a MacBook Pro should have reasonable expectation of it providing reliable service much longer than two, or even three, years. The Pismo PowerBook I’m typing this on is nearly nine years old and still going strong.
An extended service program, more along the lines of the seven-year one Apple implemented for PowerBook 5300 and 190 models back in 1996, after that model proved excessively prone to a constellation of hardware and software problems, would be more appropriate in addressing this GPU issue, which is arguably as bad or even worse than the PowerBook 5300 troubles.
Last month, Computerworld’s Gregg Keizer reported that owners of Apple, Dell and Hewlett-Packard laptops had pooled lawsuits against NVIDIA in an attempt to force the graphics chip maker to replace the allegedly flawed processors, and if granted class-action status, the case could involve millions of laptop computer owners, possibly influencing Apple’s decision to extend service coverage by 50 percent.
Here are the specific Apple products affected:
- MacBook Pro 15-inch and 17-inch models with NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics processors
- MacBook Pro (17-Inch, 2.4GHz)
- MacBook Pro (15-Inch, 2.4/2.2GHz)
- MacBook Pro (Early 2008)
These computers were manufactured between approximately May 2007 and September 2008.
If you have one of the potentially affected machines, here’s what to look for:
- Distorted or scrambled video on the computer screen
- No video on the computer screen (or external display) even though the computer is on
If your MacBook Pro is exhibiting any of the symptoms described above, you are instructed take it to an Apple Retail Store or an Apple Authorized Service Provider for evaluation, or call your local Apple Contact Center.
Apple is also issuing refunds to customers who may have paid for repairs related to this issue. Contact Apple support for details on the refund process.
Related research and analysis from GigaOM Pro:
Subscriber content. Sign up for a free trial.
I had this happen to me not too long ago. I called Apple’s customer service line and they made me wipe my entire hard drive making me lose some important stuff since it was a while since I backed it up. I took it to a certified mac repair place and they said wiping the hard drive was unnecessary.
Though all is fixed now. Just took 2 days for my laptop to get fixed and all is good now.
I had this happen to me too. Took the MBP to the repair centre and they told me that my MBP didn’t qualify. They ran a “special” hardware test behind closed doors and in the end just said “nay”.
Which leads me to conclude that Apple’s test is not accurate and some customers will be left out standing in the rain.
try calling apple support and just be persistent they will transfer you to another person. Tell your long history with apple and how it doesn’t seem right over and over again and as long as you stick to it they make exceptions….squeaky wheel gets the greese!!!
cheers
I wonder if this will extend the Applecare warranty by a year as it is an ADDITIONAL 2 year warranty. If they do extend it , will this be automatic as I am registered with Applecare on both my MBP machines……….
Hi Martin;
As I understand it, the extended service policy applies to The GeForce 8600M GPU issue only and is entirely separate from AppleCare coverage,which is not affected by the change in coverage. The extended service now covers that issue for three years regardless of whether the customer has purchased AppleCare coverage or not.
CM
Thank you for this article. My MBP’s graphics processor has died two times within the last 18 months. Both times my apple retailer had to exchange the logic board. I am glad to know now what the error was. Also thanks for the hint about the refunding program. I hope I qualify and thus have just sent a mail to Apple support stating my case.
Yes! My MBP’s processor has also died in the past and even though it was under warranty, it always scared me for the future.
Nope, Apple won’t give me a refund since my insurance covered the repair cost. I had to rent another MBP in order to work through the times of repair, but Apple won’t pay for rental fees. Now I just hope that Apple extends the warranty coverage for this case even more so I don’t have to live in fear that this happens again and again in the future.
I also have LG R700 with Nvidia GeForce M 8600 GT+. I am launching a small claim lawsuit against the manufacturer (LG) next week. I had it repaired with Bios but the problem continues – this is unacceptable. The defect was known since early 2008 and neither LG/Apple/Nvidia did anything about it.
I had this problem recently, it is a shame because I do love the OS. And they did fix with no questions ask, but now I am sitting here paranoid that it will happen outside of the extended service agreement. If it does kill over, I cannot afford to buy another one, unless there reliability has been proven for a reasonable amount of time. So, I am forced to partitioned my drive so that I will be able to remove all of the data quickly with a windows OS. Which is insane !!!
Ideally I would rather get a reliable replacement. There solution of replacing the logic boards with the same board, and having us wait until it dies, is not fair to us. We purchased these computers with expectation that have not been met. And they are not fixing the problem, they are prolonging the agony. Even the new logic boards seem to have the graphics under-clocked.
Also they have a lawsuit in place, what do we have? unreliable notebooks who service will soon expire both apple care/extended !!!
My Macbook 3.1 2007 with Geforce 8600M GT, the video is not coming on when you close the lid or when you reboot the machine. Sometime the machine will not boot at all and I found a work around to get it booting again.
System diagnostic indicated a video controller failure.
This all started after the SMC 1.3 update.
The machine is not covered by the extended warranty for what ever reason.
If you look on discussions.apple.com, you will see many such instances. So Apple are not acknowledging the full extent of this problem.
I spoke to a guy that repairs laptops and he says any machine (Apple or other) with a Gefroce 8600M GT is likely to fail.
He also says my symptoms are classic examples of the Geforce failure.
Basically some pins on the chipset are not making contact and this varies with heat conditions. If the chip does not power up, the macbook will not boot.
If it power up, the video may not work or be distorted.
When my machine would not boot (no chime just power light) I had the idea that heat caused the problem and so it may have the reverse affect.
So with a fully charged battery I turned the machine on. leave it on a flat surface until the battery runs down. It gets hot, so something is working.
Then let it cool and do not move the machine. Then hold down the power button for 5-10 sec, release it and plug in the power. Hit the power button and it could boot with video and all.
Other people have done this, so the theory is sound. It also proves this is heat related which was the same as the original failure which Apple acknowledge.
So why are these machines excluded?
Hi,
I have the same problem, so i tried your way to make it work. It did work, the screen came alive, i immediately back it up, do all my work on it, and when i try to restart the computer, the screen die on me again. Did this happen to you? If so, do i need to repeat the whole procedure of leaving it on and press the button for 5 seconds. As mentioned, it died on me after i update the OS, bloody stupid of me. Please advise what i can do to stop the screen from dying on me again, downgrade the OS? Cheers
@Clinton:
I’m have the same problem here in Karachi, Pakistan. Got screen distortion/scrambling before logic board died. Apple says it died cause of a different reason and it’s not covered. Repair store can’t carry out nvidia geforce test on a machine that won’t chime/boot. I’m wondering if you know how they managed to test yours without a chime/boot. Maybe there’s a way (other than the black hard drive they use) and I need to let my repair store in Pakistan know this.
Thanks,
Aftab
im experiencing the same problem. I am from Karachi Pakistan, and i have to tell my apple repair store a validation from apple international, but they haven’t specified a region. can anybody help?
talha, are you getting a chime? is your machine booting up? macbook pro? did you get screen scrambling and distortion before it died.
Pakistan Dial 00800 01001, then 800 361 0479 http://www.apple.com/asia/support/
from: http://www.apple.com/support/contact/phone_contacts.html
let me know what apple says.
good luck
aftab
My experience with Apple Service Centre in Singapore is that these people always claim that the problem is due to the logic board so that we have to pay for repair. I know of 3 friends who experience this rubbish from Apple Singapore even though symptoms are similar to what stated in Apple’s website.
Im Singaporean and I experience the same problem. Theres no chime and they insisted that the logic board died. I learnt that the logic board may die due to this graphic card issue. So what should i do?
I’m having the same problem here in Spain. My MBP doesn’t boot/chime anymore.
The support center (not Apple directly) says that they can’t replace the logic board (for free) since they can’t pass the gpu software test.
Apple says that, even though my computer showed “graphic artifacts” before it died completely, “if the caps lock light doesn’t light-up” then they can tell for sure that it’s not nvidia related.
I think that Apple should, at least, take a close look at these MBPs that die completely and study if they need to extend what situations are covered by the extended warranty.
I am also one of Apple’s victims I bought my Macbook Pro in Singapore 18 months ago. I am now in Malaysia and sometimes in Thailand. My logic board has been declared dead by Phuket Alpha (Apple’s agents in Phuket)
My MBP is an intel machine with NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics.
After testing behind close doors I was told I would have to pay 41,000 Bahts, about 1,234 USD. Since all my previous PCs have lasted me considerably longer than this, the most expensive laptop that I have ever bought,
I feel that I have been legally robbed by Apple.
Caveat Emptor.
My MBP 17″ had the Nvidia issue in October 2008, had it fixed at no cost in about 7 days. However the new logic board was overheating alot, even when it was just idle, it was at about 60-70 degrees, and easily 80 degrees when surfing or gaming, with the fans at max.
Yesterday (8 Jan 2010) the nvidia chip died again, right out of the blue. Just got it in the Apple Service Center in Shanghai, and they accepted the system. Hope they will not call me back and claim it’s not the nvidia problem.
My main worry is, what happens if this happens 1 year later? or 3 years later?
Apple recently extended their ’special warranty’ for this nvidia issue for 3 more years from the date of purchase between 2007 and 2008, but if it breaks down again 2 years later doesn’t that mean we are screwed?
Also, eventually that logic board will be discontinued in production, and there will no longer be parts available for replacement.
As far as I know, the logic board they replace is still the same one with the Nvidia issue, because that defect is not something they can correct without re-designing/structuring a new logic board. That means no matter how many times we get the Nvidia problem fixed, the MBP is still a ticking time bomb!
I think the best way that Apple could really prove their commitment and responsibility to their customers, is to allow owners of the affected models to at least have the option to exchange for a up-to-date Macbook Pro (without the nvidia chip in question) for a special price. That way we can at least be ensured that our fears for our Macbook Pro going kaput has been put behind us, and that will continue a longevity of appreciation of Apple’s service and products.
Mind you that the Macbook Pro 17 inch model is Apple’s top of the line notebook, the most feature-heavy and not to mention expensive model. I really would expect a little more, and certainly a little more longevity for this investment I made.
I hope someone from Apple reads this, and brings it to attention.
Fred, I hope they do. I lost a lot of confidence in their ability to support their products. Why did it take so long to admit this? Why only x year? A faulty product is faulty regardless of its age.
mine died at 25.5 months, apple repaired it along with several other minor issues. then fans failed apple repaired, now shorting in the hinge to the panel causing the screen to flick off when moved.
Same here. 17in MBP. No chime and video. Philippine Mac service said its the logic board. Same problem with all of you. MAC should fix this problem. And my next laptap wont be a MAC anymore. Shit!
Listen to this one…..My graphic processor failed as mentioned above. I took it to an Apple center. They confirmed the failure but argued that since there is a little dent in the outside cover (is a 2 yr ols machine), they have to “replace the whole display” and charge me “around 600 dollars”. Is like taking your car with a defective part on the engine for a recall and then be told that they would only perform it if you change be conditional to changing all the tires. Rather than apologize for selling a faulty product which is causing major inconvenience, they are trying to take advantage and make money. I found this unbelievable, and would like to know if anyone can suggest me what to do or who to call.
Many thanks
Hey Juan,
The display unit (LCD) is seperate from the gpu and is only connected through a small ribon cable which is easely detached. Tell them to replace the logic board (video chipset is intergrated) free of charge as stated in the applecare terms and conditions
If a hardware defect arises and a valid
claim is received within the Warranty Period, at its option and to the extent permitted by law, Apple will
either (1) repair the hardware defect at no charge, using new or parts equivalent to new in performance and
reliability, (2) exchange the product with a product that is new or equivalent to new in performance and
reliability and is at least functionally equivalent to the original product, or (3) refund the purchase price of
the product.
Print that section out and take it in to them. If they try to get you to replace the screen tell them you know the screen is seperate and if they are unable to provide a replacement logic board that is compatable with your computer then a replacement computer will be in order as stated in section 2 or a refund as in section 3.
Bear in mind that apple has stated that they will provide a repair free of charge for the faulty video chipset caused by bad packing regardless of warranty period. After they have no choice but to comply with you and you get your laptop back fixed place a formal complaint with apple to have your agents authorisation to provide apple service revoked due to major misconduct.
Thank you Kall, very interesting. I have taken it to another one and this time “ethical” service center who did not hesitate to perform the tests and repairs. I showed the small dent in the outside case and was this time reassured that it is unrelated to the graphic card. I hope to get it back fixed soon.
I will raise a formal complaint, as I thought that what the other guys tried was outrageous, and they don’t need to try to act in such a dishonest manner trying to dodge legitimate claims, or trying to recover their costs when they sell a premium product with faulty components.
I have to say that this incident has put on me a serious cloud of doubt on Apple as a whole, and that I feel a lot less confident on the brand. I hope the company is not getting arrogant and that this was a “one off”.
Wow and I thought I was the only one with problems. My Macbook pro wouldn’t start for the above mentioned reasons so I took it to an apple store. They tested it for the price of 60 € only to tell me on the phone, that it was the I/O board. An hour later in the store it was suddenly the graphic-chip but my notebook was not eligible for the mentioned free repair. On the way home I noticed that they gave me the wrong bill so I headed back and demanded to know what was really wrong. And now it was the logic-board and it would cost me 1800 € to fix it (they said this with a straight face). I send it to a repair-shop I found over the internet and they fixed it for 250 € by exchanging the (tada!) graphic-chip. Wow, that was the first and last apple computer i bought….
Just took my Macbook pro to Apple Store because of video card going out. They told me that because there is a little dent on the side of the case, that they would have to replace the case for $186 before they could swap out the logic board. This smells really fishy to me… I’m thinking the policy is to figure out how to tack on some kind of cash flow to these warranty problems.
whoa. Same here: my 17″ mbp (~2.5years old) suddenly didn’t start anymore, no screen, no chime. took it to a certified apple service tech: “seems like the graphic chip problem, but we cannot run the tests [because its dead], so we cannot get the errorcode that will make it ellegible for the warranty coverage.” the mainboard-swap would cost about 1000 EUR.
Seems like a catch22 to me: if your top-of-the-line equipment dies on you, there is no way of post-mortem telling what has made it die, even if all indicators (serial number, production date, graphic chip type) scream in your face that it is one of the bad ones. if you can’t tell the cause, it won’t be covered by the extended warranty – sorry you’re left out.
Macbook pro 15, same problem as every on else , dead graphic card , but apple did there tests and say it the logic board. No evidence of the testing, no error code of the problem. Just say its the logic board and if you want it fixing it £700.
Very disappointed, not what you expect.
I’ve had one Macbook Pro fixed for free thru the program (mid-2007 MBPro 17″ 2.4Ghz). The authorized center acknowledged the nVidia problem immediately. As everyone probably knows, they use an external USB hard disk to boot from, with a “special” diagnostic nVidia program to use to check the computer. As mentioned above, though, they have to be able to boot the computer: i.e., your MBPro has to show the “classic” signs of the problem, i.e. it boots but you get either No Video on screen or Scrambled Video; if you get no video, the MBPro should boot with NO startup chime, you will probably hear the hard disk and fans going, the charger should show a green or orange light indicating that the battery is charging, the battery should charge. My MBPro 17″ showed all these signs.
Interesting note: similar to Bjoern’s comments, the authorized center also told me that I had to have the I/O board replaced, as it wasn’t charging the battery properly. I agree with this, as it has always been a problem with my 2 MBPros from this series (I also have a 15″ 2.4Ghz) – there is often a contact problem and the MBPro says “Not Charging” even though the charger is connected. I can usually solve this by disconnecting the charger, then reconnecting it while holding it into the port firmly for a few seconds, until the light comes on green, then turns to orange. Seems like there may be a small problem with the contact.
The authorized center also said there was a problem with the USB port on the charging port side. I’d also noticed this for some time. And it also affects both my MBPros. There often doesn’t seem to be enough power supplied to the USB port. External hard disks and external DVD burners are occasionally not recognized. So the authorized center replaced the USB controller on that side too.
* I think I was lucky that the tech was able to boot my MBPro from the external USB drive. He wasn’t able to boot it from the charger-port side USB port, but he was able to boot from the port on the other side.
I am interested in knowing if anyone denied free service has been able to learn HOW the techs decide if it’s “just a logic board problem” and not related to the nVidia problem, even though the MBPro shows all the same signs. I assume they rely 100% on the special diagnostic program and the error code it spits out. The testing does seem a bit inaccurate at times, as some have noted above. How do you get exactly the same symptoms and NOT have the defective nVidia chip?
Re. the long-term reliability and worries that the problem may re-occur in time, I too was worried and decided to sell the 17″ MBPro (the buyer reports that everything’s working fine) and buy an iMac.
And here’s hoping that the 15″ MBPro keeps on going strong. Fingers crossed!
Forgot to add in my post above that when the authorized center replaced the I/O board and the nearby USB controller, they did charge me for the parts and labor, around € 40 if I remember correctly.
Other problems they find are clearly not covered by the program.
hi sean, thanks for the info.
“if you get no video, the MBPro should boot with NO startup chime, you will probably hear the hard disk and fans going, the charger should show a green or orange light indicating that the battery is charging, the battery should charge. ”
this is exactly how my mbp behaves, and Apple denies any relation to the nvidia problem, since they cannot get their diagnosticthingie working with my book.
in the meantime i have tested and can confirm that the powermanagment and the heatprotection works. the battery will drain if you leave the unresponsive book on, and will recharge when connected to the macsafe. if the book gets worm, eventually the fans will start working.
Tom.
Yes, I guess the vital thing for Apple is to be able to test it with their external USB drive with the nVidia diagnostic software. The Apple techs I met said that the diagnostic sw was provided by nVidia, not Apple, so I assume there’s some kind of warranty and responsibility issue involved too, i.e. nVidia wants to be absolutely sure that the problem is caused by their faulty chip, and not something else, probably because when the sw shows that it’s their chip at fault, they have to pay for the repairs (or their insurance has to pay). Both sides also probably want complete statistics on the issue too. So it would seem that being able to boot the MBPro from the external hard disk is a MUST if you want to qualify for the program. Question: weird or not that the diagnostics aren’t on an external disk with Firewire? I’ve NEVER had a problem with Firewire-connected peripherals in all my years of using Macs, but I have had USB-port problems with several Mac portables, from the Aluminium powerbooks onwards.
Tom: you say they weren’t able to get the USB drive “working with your book”. Does that mean they can’t BOOT the ‘book from the external drive at all? Or that it does boot, but isn’t able to diagnose the computer?
It’s frustrating, I’m sure, as I know from my own experience that the USB ports are not completely reliable. And as I said, maybe I was lucky that they were able to boot the diagnostic drive from one USB port, as the other USB wasn’t able to boot it. Otherwise they might have given me the same answer as they gave you and other people.
Question: if your MBPro shows ALL the signs of the nVidia chip problem, but is unable to boot from the external USB drive – supplied by nVidia – and the Apple techs tell you that your MBPro isn’t covered by the program, wouldn’t it be reasonable to try to get them to boot and test your computer some other way? e.g. They must be able to test for the problem while your MBPro is being used in Firewire Target mode. Or is that impossible?
sean,
my MBP will not boot, no chime, no keyboard-reaction – so it will not respond in FW mode, too i guess. problem is, the first tech put the internal drive in an external enclosure for me to get access to my data, so now, without the internal drive, nothing would show up in firewiremode, or so I think.
But everything else aside: I got a call from Apple Customercare today and after relaying all the info I had on the issue, and the statements from the techs, and my effords during the last week, they made “an exception” and will cover the mainboard repair/swap by warranty.
I am very glad that they are willing to view this issue not only from the technical standpoint – which indeed is that one has no way of telling what went wrong with my MBP since it will not boot properly – but they also see this in regard of user experience, and are willing to admit that this is very very frustrating and not appropriate to what might be expected with a top-of-the-line product like the 17″ mbp.
let me clarify: the mbp seems to boot right into sleep mode. you hear the dvddrive working for a while, no startupchime is audible, the screen stays black (an external screen also). the front led is on (if you nearly close the cover it will dim), the harddrive has current and is spinning, but there seem to be no read/write action. the battery is charging and draining as one might expect. the book will get warm if it is on for a while.
Tom.
I wanted to mention that when I took my 17″ MBPro in to get checked, it didn’t have the hard disk installed. The techs said it didn’t matter, as they had to boot from the external disk anyway.
You’re right re. Firewire Target mode, as a HD would have to be installed for it to work – your computer is seen as an external FW drive.
Re. your Macbook Pro problems Tom, you seem to have been treated badly. The symptoms you described are EXACTLY the same you get when you have the nVidia chip problem. I mean, I still haven’t heard any explanation as to why a MBPro would behave like yours (the symptoms you described) WITHOUT the problem being the nVidia chip defect. I would really like to hear an Apple tech’s explanation about that, at least from a technical point of view. I would guess though that their refusal to put a MBPro thru the free program is automatic, i.e. if the nVidia diagnostics don’t return the expected error code, then the chip defect hasn’t been detected. But there should be some sort of additional “human” check they can make, if and when they get a MBPro that has all the classic symptoms.
Anyway, congrats on getting the MBPro fixed for free. Great stuff.
This may sound stupid, but does anybody know whether the machine has be currently exibiting symptoms in order for nVidia’s diagnostic tools to identify the problem? My MBPro’s display miraculously started working again and now I don’t know what to do.
Here’s what happened:
Several weeks ago I got a black screen and no reponse from the computer at all. I tried everything in my limited arsenal such as resetting PRAM and SMC and eventually regained some life and the caps lock key would light up and I could hear the audible feedback when I adjusted the volume.
I found out about the graphics chips issue and it sounded spot on, so I turned on VoiceOver and stumbled my way through adding a new user and deleting existing users to get rid of the personal data before taking the machine to the shop.
After patting my self on the back for sludging through a couple hours worth of sight-free computing, I turned the machine on this morning to make one last change and… everything works perfectly. Beautiful, crystal-clear display.
Crap.
I don’t know if my thing was unrelated to the graphics chip problem or if it is only working temporarily and will quit again eventually.
I don’t think I can take it to my local Mac place and say, “This is working fine, could you fix it?”
Am I the only one this has happened to? Any suggestions at what my next step should be?
Ok, here’s a small update:
After running an operation that took a good amount of time to execute (secure empty trash), the computer once again was without video after a restart.
After shutting computer off and charging for a couple hours, the screen came back again after a restart. A couple of restarts later, it’s gone again.
This would seem to indicate that this is tempurature-related. However, I’d had several cold-starts before without the video coming back.
I guess I’ll have to drop to my knees at the Genius Bar and beg for mercy.
Ok, all fixed with no charge. It took me three calls to the local independent shop and two to Apple to get it done, but I got it fixed in the end. My favorite part was when the local shop told me to call Apple a second time and “act really mad” to get the approval code.
Might be temperature-related. That’s what a few people are saying around the Net. Whatever it is, it seems strange that some computers that show exactly the same symptoms as ones diagnosed with the nVidia defect don’t get the same diagnosis from the nVidia software check.
Anyway, here I go AGAIN…. My wife’s Macbook Pro 17″ 2.6Ghz with the nVidia 8600M GT chip and Hi-Res display option is also now showing the problems associated with the defect: black screen on boot, fans and HD start up and run, I can hear the DVD drive running to, the charging light on the AC adapter turns on, first orange and then green, and the battery charges. Exactly the same as happened with my own 15″ 2.4Ghz with the 8600M GT, which had the logic board replaced in the recall program.
I’m off to the nearest authorized Apple store on Monday or Tuesday to get it checked. Would be weird – and to me, unacceptable – if it doesn’t get diagnosed as having the problem, as the symptoms are exactly the same. I should also note that the MBP has never been dropped, bumped, etc., has actually been treated with kid gloves, and that the problem appeared absolutely out of the blue one day: i.e., working perfectly up till that point, no hints of any problems, but after shutting down as per normal, when we next booted up we got the black screen. Having already had some experience with the problem on my 15″ 2.4Ghz, I thought “uh oh, here we go again”. Bad bad timing too, as we are loaded with work.
Seems like we’ve had some really bad luck with this line, given how much they cost, the great specs they had on paper, etc. We’ve been Mac users for about 20 years now, have converted a lot of folks too, but till now we’ve missed out on any of the hardware problems.
I’ll keep the forum posted on how things turn out at the Apple store next week.
Just got back from an Apple reseller, who checked our MBPro 2.6Ghz with black screen problems. I’d called previous and asked if they were able to do the nVidia defect diagnostic check and he said sure, so I took the MBP the next day and, naturally, they didn’t have the external drive to do the check, they could only send it to the local authorized techs they use. They were really friendly, but I was not too happy re. wasting my time.
Anyway, the guy wanted to check the MBP, so he booted it up in Safe Mode and, lo and behold, for the first time in about 10 days, the screen came on right away. I was a bit surprised, but I’d never thought of trying to boot in Safe Mode. Duh! Enthusiasm curbed though when we could only get a Folder with flashing question mark. He tried to boot it from an iMac in Firewire Target mode, but that didn’t work. They didn’t have an external HD in the store (!) Obviously not equipped to do many in-store tests.
Anyway, that was a surprise. The MBP had given several signs of the nVidia defect (HD, fans, DVD, charger light all coming on at boot, battery charging normally – but black screen, no chime, no illuminated keyboard). I had another MPB 17 with the nVidia defect last fall and the logic board was replaced for free. It had the same symptoms. So I had some experience with the problem.
So, as to the next step. What do you think about the screen coming on, with the Folder and flashing question mark, when booting in Safe Mode? The guy in the Apple store (not an Apple tech) agreed to check it over, as he thinks it’s a problem with the hard disk. He said they could do “minor” tests and repairs without having to send it out to the authorized techs. By “minor” he said he means that if they find the problems were caused by a bad hard disk or faulty RAM or even bad cables on the logic board, they’d call me to update me, quote me a price and ask for the go-ahead to replace whatever needed replacing. He repeated a couple of times that he felt it was the hard disk.
He was pretty convincing and wanted me to leave it with him so he could do his tests. I wasn’t sure, as I have opened up the MBP several times and can replace a HD no problem. I would normally save the 60 Euro or so, but I was thinking that it might make it easier to get them to replace the logic board for free if it comes to that. I mean, I was fairly sure it was the nVidia defect, and he’s fairly sure that the logic board isn’t the problem (i.e. it booted up), so that would be a positive with regards to situations where Apple techs refuse the free repair because they say the problem (black screen, etc.) is “only” the logic board and not the nVidia chip.
But anyway, that’s maybe getting ahead of things, as I have to hear back from them in the next couple days. Keeping fingers crossed re. having only a “minor” problem!
P.S. anyone have any ideas/experience re. the seemingly dead/black screen coming on when booting in Safe Mode?
I just ran into this issue last night. Boot up sounded/appeared fine, but black screen. Tried hooking up external monitor, still no luck. Took it into the store today, they ran the test with an external hard drive hooked in via USB, holding the ‘F’ key during bootup. When they looked at the test results, error was “No graphics Card Found” or something similar (because I was able to see their screen). They said it was this issue and are replacing the logic board for free, and I was told they will not be wiping out my hard drive in the process.
Assuming all turns out ok, I’m very happy with Apple for taking care of this issue on a laptop that is outside warranty. Things like this will keep me buying their products.
My MBP 15 (2008) has this problem only on the external display (distorted image, green lines). Are these the first signs of my GeForce GPU falling apart?
I just had the same issues that everyone else is talking about and my machine was produced during the same time frame as Apple says is covered but the have proceeded to tell me that my particular machine is not one of the ones that qualifies for their program. This is after they sent it off to the Deopt and could not get the machine to fail for any of their test, then replaced the logic board at my expense in hopes of solving the problem.
Here we go again.
This time it’s my own 15″ Macbook Pro 2.2Ghz with nVidia 8600GT chip that gets the black screen on boot or wake from sleep.
I say “again” because I’ve had 2 x 17″ units from this series already show the nVidia chip failures. Though the computers have been a bit of a disaster, Apple has been great to replace the logic boards for free.
Now it’s my MBPro’s turn. It’s a bit of puzzle, but it is showing the usual signs of the problem. It suddenly would boot only to a black screen: I got boot chime, DVD and HD and fans came on, the battery charged, etc. No internal video and no video on external monitor.
I was able to boot in Target Disk Mode on our Intel iMac, then I erased the drive and cloned a good 10.5.8 system from the iMac to the MBPro. That went okay and I hoped that any possible software problems had been rectified. I then turned to possible hardware problems and am checking if the problem may have been the RAM. I had 2 x 2GB Crucial modules installed, so I pulled them and put in 2 x 512MB of known good original Apple RAM.
So now the MBPro boots okay! I get to the desktop, login, etc. But here’s the kicker: NOT always. And as I’ve been studying the MBPro a lot the last couple days, I am definitely on the side of those who think the nVidia problem is HEAT RELATED.
When the computer is on, the MBPro’s fans go a mile a minute. They are really working hard and loudly. And the area between the keyboard and screen (on the top) gets boiling hot. And so does the corresponding area on the bottom of the MBPro. Really, really hot.
Since I cloned the HD with a new system and changed the RAM, the MBPro boots okay most of the time. The 2 times it’s recently booted or rebooted to a black screen was when it had been working for a bit and was really hot.
I am currently updating to Snow Leopard and hope to eliminate any possible software conflicts, problems, etc. With a fresh install of 10.6 I will then do more testing on the MBPro, specifically re. excess heat and the black screen.
I am tempted to take it into an Apple center anyway, just to have them look at it. In particular, LISTEN to it, i.e. the fans when it gets hot. I wonder if there’d be any sense in having them see it boot fine, then get really really hot, then see if it boots to a black screen. Especially if they do the nVidia test and it says that the computer is okay. I’ll keep you posted.
Apple’s website for the NVIDIA GeForce 8600 defect for MacBook Pro’s now mentions 4 years coverage instead of just 3.
I so far haven’t found when exactly they made this change, but it is interesting that they have extended it a second time.
Where is that at? on the apple nvidia’s issue page there is no mention of time limits whatsoever, could you please point it out to me?
oops never mind I just checked! but since I’ve already bothered you, would you mind giving me some advice on the matter :( I sent my Pro to a local apple retailer and they said it’s not nvidia and I have to pay 1200$, my question is: how about if I sent the laptop to the united states, would they fix it for free there? and how about those 350$ something logic boards on ebay? are they real?
I like to know that any barn case are not replace or repair ( in warranty ) by the manufacturer . My Card has been barn but service center telling it will not be done . What i can do with this card.
hi everyone!
I have the same problem with my macbook pro.. as i am seeing a lot of users are frustrated with the services provided by apple with same kinda issue. do you think doing law suit against apple would help? or could be good idea… if Yes.. anyone wanna join in???
hi everyone!
I have the same problem with my macbook pro.. as i am seeing a lot of users are frustrated with the services provided by apple with same kinda issue. do you think doing law suit claim against apple would help? or could be good idea… as we spend a lot of money ofor buying this product just for with a life of hardly 2 years??? if Yes.. anyone wanna join in???
I just got my MBPro 2.4 Ghz (nVidia 8600M) back from the Apple techs and they replaced the logic board for free as part of the recall program. Great stuff. Solved my black screen on reboot and sleep problem.
The only thing I’d like to add is that there’s now a vertical red line near the left edge of the screen that runs the entire height of the screen. It’s pretty thin, about 1 pixel wide I guess, and it was never PERMANENTLY there before getting the logic board replaced: it was BLUE when it first showed up, but it wasn’t permanent, then it started to show up RED. I had the black screen problem so I couldn’t be sure if it had become permanent, but I don’t think so. And now it is there and it’s permanent, or so it seems.
It is not a line of bad pixels, I should add. If I drag a white background window over the area, you DON’T see the red line through the window; i.e., it is BEHIND the window. Which I’ve never seen before.
I just got the computer back today and am currently updating to 10.6.4, but I don’t know if that will make any difference.
Does anyone think the red line (formerly blue) could be related to the nVidia graphics card problem?
I believe I am having the same problem as everyone else but I am not certain.
I purchased my 15″ 2.2GHZ MacBook Pro in August of 2007.
In September of 2009 I began experiencing problems with my screen. It would scramble and shake. Because I was still under the Apple Care Protection Plan I made a service call in and they guessed that the issue was a lose wire in the screen. I never did make it in to fix this issue (fail) and of course the issue has only gotten worse over the last three months (AppleCare ended in 08/2010).
The screen would still shake, scramble, and cut out.
I recently purchase the new iPhone 4 only to find out that it could not sync with Tiger OS. Awesome, works with PCs but not Apples old OS? So…. I spend money to upgrade to Snow Leopard.
I was still having video issues with the screen when made the mistake of closing the lid. Ever since then the computer will boot to a black screen. I DO however get a chime, lighting keyboard and sound buttons work.
Now, as I said before Apple suggested that the issue could have been a lose wire in the screen. However if that was the case, only the internal monitor would be effected. I get a black screen when I boot to an external monitor as well.
I have tried all possible fixes in the forums (resets, battery die, target mode, etc) all with no luck.
I then stumbled upon the Apple article on the NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics processor. I noticed that the time frame fit when I purchased my MacBook Pro and also I had experienced both the symptoms.
I was relieved to know the repair would still be fixed free of charge… or so I thought.
I took it to an Apple Authorized Retail Provider (AARP) where they said they would “run a test on it” and let me know. I didn’t get 5 minutes down the road before I got a voicemail claiming that “no eligible graphics processor was found” and therefore would not be covered under the extended repair plan. I was also told that I could pay a $75 diagnostics fee and then $300 to ship and being repairs, then pay parts and labor after that.
I refused to do that, and when I picked up the computer today I spoke with another Apple “genius type” there and he ran my Serial Number and told me I do indeed have that card in my computer.
Regardless of whether or not the NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics processor is causing the issue, shouldn’t all of us with the card in our computer be subject to a replacement free of charge? Apple is essentially saying they have a recalled part, but if that doesn’t break in their time frame they won’t fix it? Ridiculous.
I called into Apple tonight in fury and told the person what I have attempted to this point. He confirmed that I have the graphics card in my computer and gave me a Case Number. I will be trying a different AARP tomorrow, hopefully with more success.
I had the same problem 2 days ago, my macbook pro 17″ with the nVidia 8600gt chip won’t boot.
- no chime
- no screen
- keyboard not working, no light from caplock and numlock
- fan was working
- HHD was working
- dvd was working
- but the power light was steady and not blinking
Since it couldn’t even boot, was not able to reset PRAM or use voice control.
I took it to the Genuis Bar in an Apple Store to get it fix for free since I read it was becuase of the faulty nVidia chip. A lady infront of me also had the same problem but her MB chime and was able to boot but with no screen and was able to get her MB fixed for free.
Inorder for them to replace it for free they need to do the test but since my MB won’t even boot they couldn’t start the test so therefor they won’t fix mine. They said it was the logic baord.
So i took it home and did research and read online about people heating the nVidia chip on thier MB to get it to work.
I did this and it works!! Just google nVidia and reflow. Some people left their MB on to heat it up and some even placed the logic board in the oven, no kidding. I used a heat gun and heated the nVidia chip. This fixed the conection between the nvidia chip and the logic board.
Im not sure if this is temporary fix or not so i’ll take it back to the apple store tomorrow since it can boot and they can run the test. My MB seems fine so i dont know if they will replace it or not. The only thing is i noticed it gets really hot in a short amount of time, just like someone stated before.
I hear victims of faulty macbook pro logic boards every now and then, and it seems like those who suffer with a failure NOT due to the nvidia chip (as apple technicians say) are the majority, with a little more investigation it turns out our laptops fried themselves right after an SMC update!
Now for the love of God, how is that our fault?!?! 1200$ for repairs?!?!
Could anyone confirm those logic boards on ebay do work? they sell for 350$ or something, are they real?? :(
Hi all
I also have the “logic board” problem. Same symptoms as everyone. I went to the genius bar they told me it’s not the graphic card but after seeing this article and comments, I went again.
I think that the nVidia chip is causing the logic board fault due to overheating, then it’s a question of what thing dies first: either the graphic card and the genius can do the test, good for you, or it’s the logic board and you’re screwed.
They would not agree on this and they stick to the graphic test, if your macbook pro doesn’t boot it can not be performed so they say the logic board is faulty. Apple is clearly trying to avoid its responsabilities here, the problem is obviously linked.
Anyway after arguing quite some time with the Apple manager he offered me a rebate on the logic board change. I went to the Apple Store Opera, Paris, France. If you are obstinate enough I think you can sway a manager to offer something like this. Say that you wanted to sell the thing to buy a new Mac or something and now you’re stuck with a worthless brick. For 250€ (~330$) I will have a new logic board, I think it’s better than selling it for pieces.
If everyone having the “logic board issue” with the 8600M GT complain enough in the Apple Stores, Apple might change its mind and issue a full refund on this for every owner of 2007-2008 Macbook pro, as I think they should.
So I was not aware of any mvp graphics card issue until just last week. I was having similar but different issues than most on here that have posted. My mvp would work for a while then would get hot and the screen would freeze with fluorescent lines acrros the last image the mbp was on then after a reboot and battery pulls, at startup I would get rectangular gray checker board screen at the apple screen-then frozen screen. This would happen until I allowed the mbp to cool down. This began to happen 2 months ago. The first it occurred I chalked it up to random occurrence, then the frequency increased to the point where I could only use the mbp for 20 min at a time before this would happen again.
So here is the good news. I when to the local authorized dealer, I recommend not going to an apple store they are too cloak and dagger with service, and they ran the graphics test right in front of me. The test passed and they sent me Hm. That night the mbp simply died and I could not get passed the apple at bootup so I decided to go back for one more test. This time a more knowledgeable perso. Helped me and she recognized right away that the light strove on the front of the mbp was striving 2 steady and 4 quick. She immediatel said this normally means the graphics card has failed. She ran the test again and what do u know, I got a new logicboard. So be persistant and I recommend keeping your mbp hot and running all night then quickly take it to your local authorized dealer and have them run the test. Worked for me. Good luck.
My MBP died last week due to
No boot-up
No chime
Dim sleep light
Harddrive and disk drive were alive and the power was going through fine.
All the tricks didnt work, and target disk mode didnt work.
Took it the apple store, genius thought it was the graphics card, but couldnt prove it, so they did a test behind closed doors. Turns out it was the nVidia problem, so they are replacing both graphics card and logic board for free.
But i would imagine everyone whos laptop displays the same symptoms should get a free repair, the genius said that in most cases the graphics card destroys the logic board and they cant really tell what happened, so if apple refuse to pay, get a second opinion
Congratulations for all of you who get replacement after 2nd 3rd trials. I’ve to put up with their final judgemnt on my dead MBP. Don’t know why i’ve got emailed informing me of new comments on this article, since my last comment won’t show up here.. I’m tired of pushing them, acting angry, getting angry blah blah to apple rep. Lost my work, my opportunity on that machine. bye apple!
appleblackscreen.wordpress.com
Excuse me sir, but what do you mean by “trials”, please do expand, I’m sorry to hear that you’ve had to put up with a tragedy though, some are still waiting and many have given up.