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	<title>Comments on: Whose Fault Is Traffic Shaping, App Blocking?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/</link>
	<description>Tracking the Internet Evolution</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 11 Oct 2008 18:01:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: BroadDev - Unified Communications, Virtualization, Security, and Web 2.0 &#187; FCC Metered Broadband and Om Malik</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-891504</link>
		<dc:creator>BroadDev - Unified Communications, Virtualization, Security, and Web 2.0 &#187; FCC Metered Broadband and Om Malik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jul 2008 18:38:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-891504</guid>
		<description>[...] public image, Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin has taken up a populist and politically lucrative crusade against the evil cable company Comcast and its nefarious efforts to block certain kinds of [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] public image, Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin has taken up a populist and politically lucrative crusade against the evil cable company Comcast and its nefarious efforts to block certain kinds of [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Yo FCC. You Doing Anything About Metered Broadband? - GigaOM</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-891396</link>
		<dc:creator>Yo FCC. You Doing Anything About Metered Broadband? - GigaOM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jul 2008 05:18:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-891396</guid>
		<description>[...] public image, Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin has take up a populist and politically lucrative crusade against the evil cable company, Comcast and its nefarious efforts to block certain kinds of [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] public image, Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin has take up a populist and politically lucrative crusade against the evil cable company, Comcast and its nefarious efforts to block certain kinds of [...]</p>
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		<title>By: On BitTorrent, FCC Chastises Comcast - GigaOM</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-890760</link>
		<dc:creator>On BitTorrent, FCC Chastises Comcast - GigaOM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jul 2008 03:56:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-890760</guid>
		<description>[...] I don&#8217;t care much for Comcast&#8217;s traffic managing ways &#8212; having written about it time and again &#8212; but this just seeks like an opportunistic and populist-baiting move from an [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I don&#8217;t care much for Comcast&#8217;s traffic managing ways &#8212; having written about it time and again &#8212; but this just seeks like an opportunistic and populist-baiting move from an [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Comcast Caught, Denies Blocking Traffic - GigaOM</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-888025</link>
		<dc:creator>Comcast Caught, Denies Blocking Traffic - GigaOM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 14:38:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-888025</guid>
		<description>[...] network traffic and that such traffic blocking needs to stop. The enforcement order was prompted by a complaint from the non-profit group, Free Press, and the Commission will vote on the order at an open meeting on Aug. 1. The order would require [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] network traffic and that such traffic blocking needs to stop. The enforcement order was prompted by a complaint from the non-profit group, Free Press, and the Commission will vote on the order at an open meeting on Aug. 1. The order would require [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Martin, Skewered - GigaOM</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-880878</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Martin, Skewered - GigaOM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 May 2008 03:16:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-880878</guid>
		<description>[...] Look at this video and you get an idea that this is a future politician talking. I blame him and FCC for our current broadband mess. There is no running away from it, whatever he says. Too bad, I [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Look at this video and you get an idea that this is a future politician talking. I blame him and FCC for our current broadband mess. There is no running away from it, whatever he says. Too bad, I [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-878780</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 May 2008 09:38:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-878780</guid>
		<description>I'm not surprised at all that ISPs are messing with bittorrent traffic and would actually be surprised if there were any ISPs that DON'T mess with bittorrent. I think it is terrible though, especially since it just seems like all of these ISPs want to do everything they can to stop people from using their networks so that they don't have to spend money on infrastructure. I understand it costs a lot of money to actually give people what they are paying for but YOU got yourself into this mess by promising people speeds that you knew you couldn't deliver on and then when we complain you say "we say up to 4mbps" COME ON.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not surprised at all that ISPs are messing with bittorrent traffic and would actually be surprised if there were any ISPs that DON&#8217;T mess with bittorrent. I think it is terrible though, especially since it just seems like all of these ISPs want to do everything they can to stop people from using their networks so that they don&#8217;t have to spend money on infrastructure. I understand it costs a lot of money to actually give people what they are paying for but YOU got yourself into this mess by promising people speeds that you knew you couldn&#8217;t deliver on and then when we complain you say &#8220;we say up to 4mbps&#8221; COME ON.</p>
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		<title>By: Robb Topolski</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-878776</link>
		<dc:creator>Robb Topolski</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 May 2008 06:27:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-878776</guid>
		<description>Good article.  

As to why the results show Cable interference but not DSL...

As early as 2003, Prof. Tim Wu noted in his paper "Network Neutrality, Broadband Discrimination" (Journal of Telecommunications and High Technology Law 2: p.141 with article copies widely available on the net) that Cable and DSL were on two different tracks: Cable was heavily use-restricted (e.g. "no servers, no VPN, no fun, etc.") while DSL was not.  

Five years later, this is still the case.  Verizon is on the record that they do not discriminate, they do not throttle, (but they are keeping open their options to do so).

But your larger conclusion is right on -- with sufficient competition, ISPs can throttle anything they want and freedom is not impaired.  Take dial-up, for example.  There are hundreds of choices -- many who proudly filter connections AS A FEATURE.  

The FCC applied the same thinking to broadband and "hoped" that competition would show up.  Well, "hope" is no replacement for a strategy as it turns out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good article.  </p>
<p>As to why the results show Cable interference but not DSL&#8230;</p>
<p>As early as 2003, Prof. Tim Wu noted in his paper &#8220;Network Neutrality, Broadband Discrimination&#8221; (Journal of Telecommunications and High Technology Law 2: p.141 with article copies widely available on the net) that Cable and DSL were on two different tracks: Cable was heavily use-restricted (e.g. &#8220;no servers, no VPN, no fun, etc.&#8221;) while DSL was not.  </p>
<p>Five years later, this is still the case.  Verizon is on the record that they do not discriminate, they do not throttle, (but they are keeping open their options to do so).</p>
<p>But your larger conclusion is right on &#8212; with sufficient competition, ISPs can throttle anything they want and freedom is not impaired.  Take dial-up, for example.  There are hundreds of choices &#8212; many who proudly filter connections AS A FEATURE.  </p>
<p>The FCC applied the same thinking to broadband and &#8220;hoped&#8221; that competition would show up.  Well, &#8220;hope&#8221; is no replacement for a strategy as it turns out.</p>
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		<title>By: Between the Lines mobile edition</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-878648</link>
		<dc:creator>Between the Lines mobile edition</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 10:52:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-878648</guid>
		<description>[...] Richard Koman: Comcast, Cox block BitTorrent 24/7. Om Malik: Whose Fault Is Traffic Shaping, App Blocking? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Richard Koman: Comcast, Cox block BitTorrent 24/7. Om Malik: Whose Fault Is Traffic Shaping, App Blocking? [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: john@pm</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-878606</link>
		<dc:creator>john@pm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 03:37:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-878606</guid>
		<description>In response to Doug's last paragraph: I think the problem is that most Americans don't distinguish the unbridled internet whatever flavor of it we purchase and use in our homes. As a result, people will continue to pay for whatever reshaped, restructured, or tailored version of the web they have become accustomed to. This is something Americans really cannot afford to stand for.

We've grown accustomed to the illusion that the internet is this free, open thing. For all intents and purposes it has been and is for many people. Becoming aware that the internet probably isn't as pure as we'd like is a harsh reality to face, but that knowledge will change how we approach it as a tool. Hopefully we can get to a point where we needn't worry about the integrity of our telecom providers. Europe seems to have figured something out judging by the lack of red on the map from the second link of the original post:

http://broadband.mpi-sws.mpg.de/transparency/results/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to Doug&#8217;s last paragraph: I think the problem is that most Americans don&#8217;t distinguish the unbridled internet whatever flavor of it we purchase and use in our homes. As a result, people will continue to pay for whatever reshaped, restructured, or tailored version of the web they have become accustomed to. This is something Americans really cannot afford to stand for.</p>
<p>We&#8217;ve grown accustomed to the illusion that the internet is this free, open thing. For all intents and purposes it has been and is for many people. Becoming aware that the internet probably isn&#8217;t as pure as we&#8217;d like is a harsh reality to face, but that knowledge will change how we approach it as a tool. Hopefully we can get to a point where we needn&#8217;t worry about the integrity of our telecom providers. Europe seems to have figured something out judging by the lack of red on the map from the second link of the original post:</p>
<p> (<a href="http://broadband.mpi-sws.mpg.de/transparency/results/" rel="nofollow">link</a>) </p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-878584</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 00:14:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-878584</guid>
		<description>Hard for me to read that post and not speak up. The fact is that there IS competition and fairly fierce competition at that. How many mail pieces do you get EVERY week from your local cable operator or telco? How often are they running special offers. All the time.

Sure, there are really only two "real" options, but broadband over power line? C'mon. We here in Silicon Valley sometimes forget that we're not average tech consumers. The vast majority of consumers expect to get their telecom services from telecom providers. That's just how it is. BPL might be a nice idea, but let's get real. It failed and will continue to do so for many very good reasons. Also, don't forget that there are satellite data options out there too. Sure, it's expensive and not a great service, but it's still competition.

Bottom line... cable and DSL are the best two alternatives until WiMAX/LTE or HSPA become real alternatives. The business model and subsequent demise of Metro WiFi is proof that some alternatives aren't even viable. Cable and DSL (as much as folks might hate the power they have) have built a business model that works and they have every right to maintain that business model.

The public will speak with their pocketbooks. When they stop spending or find a "real" alternative, the evil Telco/MSO duopoly will have to do something. Until then, it's hard to blame the FCC or the providers for providing a service people are willing to pay for.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hard for me to read that post and not speak up. The fact is that there IS competition and fairly fierce competition at that. How many mail pieces do you get EVERY week from your local cable operator or telco? How often are they running special offers. All the time.</p>
<p>Sure, there are really only two &#8220;real&#8221; options, but broadband over power line? C&#8217;mon. We here in Silicon Valley sometimes forget that we&#8217;re not average tech consumers. The vast majority of consumers expect to get their telecom services from telecom providers. That&#8217;s just how it is. BPL might be a nice idea, but let&#8217;s get real. It failed and will continue to do so for many very good reasons. Also, don&#8217;t forget that there are satellite data options out there too. Sure, it&#8217;s expensive and not a great service, but it&#8217;s still competition.</p>
<p>Bottom line&#8230; cable and DSL are the best two alternatives until WiMAX/LTE or HSPA become real alternatives. The business model and subsequent demise of Metro WiFi is proof that some alternatives aren&#8217;t even viable. Cable and DSL (as much as folks might hate the power they have) have built a business model that works and they have every right to maintain that business model.</p>
<p>The public will speak with their pocketbooks. When they stop spending or find a &#8220;real&#8221; alternative, the evil Telco/MSO duopoly will have to do something. Until then, it&#8217;s hard to blame the FCC or the providers for providing a service people are willing to pay for.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-878578</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 May 2008 23:45:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-878578</guid>
		<description>Interesting idea - it would be harder to buy elected officials charged with  narrow authorities.  Could it make it past challenges on Constitutional grounds?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting idea - it would be harder to buy elected officials charged with  narrow authorities.  Could it make it past challenges on Constitutional grounds?</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Kapustka</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-878574</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Kapustka</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 May 2008 22:50:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-878574</guid>
		<description>Maybe make the FCC commisioner positions elected offices? That way, you have people accountable to the voters, and not to lobbyists/political parties?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe make the FCC commisioner positions elected offices? That way, you have people accountable to the voters, and not to lobbyists/political parties?</p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://gigaom.com/2008/05/15/whose-fault-is-traffic-shaping-app-blocking/#comment-878573</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 May 2008 22:46:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gigaom.com/?p=13443#comment-878573</guid>
		<description>Tough to see the pipe companies changing soon, or the FCC making them change.

Your choice if you're AT&#38;T, Comcast or others:  Spend a couple billion on an established IP-based media, com or combo alternative (If you can - Skype is probably available, YouTube is gone, Facebook's too expensive), spend a couple hundred million to build your own and probably fail (think Hulu), or spend 10-30 million for a good chance to control Congress, probably with all your peers pulling in the same direction instead of wrestling with you (as they would in the first couple of options).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tough to see the pipe companies changing soon, or the FCC making them change.</p>
<p>Your choice if you&#8217;re AT&amp;T, Comcast or others:  Spend a couple billion on an established IP-based media, com or combo alternative (If you can - Skype is probably available, YouTube is gone, Facebook&#8217;s too expensive), spend a couple hundred million to build your own and probably fail (think Hulu), or spend 10-30 million for a good chance to control Congress, probably with all your peers pulling in the same direction instead of wrestling with you (as they would in the first couple of options).</p>
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